Senator Joseph Waku, one of those that contested for the APC governorship ticket in Benue State in the recent election, speaks on the crisis in the National Assembly and other issues.

The APC promised to zone Senate positions but later recanted. Don't you think that contributed to the current crisis?

When you put people together, and you want to dance, you should be the best dancer. People are going to watch you; if you fail it will be on you. Lawal Shu'aibu should have educated them about what happened in the fourth Senate. It was the APC in which he was a member that supported my group to elect Enwerem as the Senate president. And it was on the basis of that for the first time that the Nigerian parliament decided to create the positions of chairmen of committees and appointed members of the opposition because of the collaboration that we received from them. Otherwise, they are supposed to be vice chairmen while the ruling party members will be the chairmen. We created that to give them identity. We are running one Senate, and that was what we did.

You choose a leader in the National Assembly who majority of the members will accept. But if you choose based on outside influence, there would be many banana peels for him. Nnamani was chosen after Wabara was kicked out. Members of the Senate led by the late Senator Idris Kuta said we are not going to take any nomination from the executive. So, Buhari lived long in this country and he is an experienced person. He knew what the country went through, whether he was an actor or not, he was a good watcher, having learnt a lot from the country's past mistakes, he kept off. That is leadership. It is not for a good leader to force somebody to do things against his will not even a group of individuals empowered by law to do what they did. That was why they revolted and what we have seen was the result of that revolt.

The party initially rejected the emergence of Saraki and Dogara...

First, that behaviour by the party leadership was a miscalculated reaction over a simple issue. It is only an irresponsible parent that will support some of his sons in a dispute over the success of the others. We are not in support of that. And it is sad that they brought in some novices who have found themselves in positions of leadership of our party. Instead of them to govern and direct the affairs of our party legitimately with compassion, patience and diplomacy, they began to show arrogance. It will not work. Nigerians have gone beyond that, and that was exactly what happened. Nigerians have spoken. The law says the members of the Senate or House of Representatives should choose among themselves their leaders. Look at the mockery they called 'Mock election' giving Dogara three votes, then going into the parliament and getting over 180 votes. They should be ashamed of themselves for this singular act of partiality. When we came into the Senate in 1999, the PDP had 66 senators which was a comfortable majority, but because there was going to be more than one candidate, we needed support from the other political parties like the APP and the AD. I was at the head of the negotiations. So, it is not as if this things started happening today. It was during our time, when PDP as a political party narrowed down on the late Senator Chuba Okadigbo and we said no. We supported Senator Evans Enwerem and that was the campaign I coordinated. I brought in the AD and the APP. At that time, some of the APP members wanted to sponsor me as their choice candidate, but after thorough discussion and because the positions of Vice President and Speaker came from the North, it was not fair for the Senate president to come again from the North. I advised against it and we went to the South-East and had a choice, and we brought in Enwerem in collaboration with other political parties. This is not the first time. Senator Shu'aibu, who is the national deputy chairman, who was in that picture should have advised his other colleagues that this may not work. We tried it before, it didn't work. But I don't know whether his advice was turned down, ignored or he didn't offer any. That is why I cannot categorically accuse anybody. So, this is what happened. At the moment, the parliament has been inaugurated. The lawmakers have the independence to do what they need to do, which they have done. Whatever happened that day was through constitutional provision, legitimately, constitutionally approved and legislatively in order. I rather pity those who attempted to subvert the system. The president and the commander in chief issued a proclamation to the Clerk of the National Assembly that on the 9th of June at 10 o'clock in the morning the Assembly should be inaugurated. If not for disrespect and irresponsible behaviours, all members should have assembled at the National Assembly by 9:30am to take their positions. All the Horse trading and negotiations should have been done on the eve of that day and whatever position they have should have been taken and then exhibited in the parliament. But instead on that day and time you summoned a meeting. The president did not issue a proclamation of APC parliament because it has no parliament, there is only one parliament, and that is the National Assembly which has members of other political parties. Any lawmaker who violated this should be sanctioned for negligence and irresponsible behaviour. And the law says, one-third of the parliamentarians, one-third of 109 forms a quorum. Even the PDP would have gotten the Senate Presidency and nothing would have happened, but somebody who knows his worth, who knows the importance of the order by the Commander-in-Chief moved into the parliament at the time that was stipulated. The others who defied the order should hold themselves responsible for what happened. In fact, they attempted to hold the National Assembly to ransom. It amounts to an attempted coup. They should be sanctioned. But the other lawmakers present in the chambers took the decision which saw the emergence of the National Assembly leadership. It is not a difficult matter and you have a majority not an overwhelming majority that you should be very very careful. During the first fourth Senate, we had 66 senators, the other political parties put together had 53, yet we went lobbying for them, because we know that we are going to have more than one candidate. So, we needed to galvanise other political parties' members to get what we needed. For the party to think that it can put those elected and independent minded individuals in a room and teleguide them, it will not work. It has not worked, and it has been proven that it will never work. You need to go through a diplomatic approach, persuasions work more in democratic dispensations. There were 74 senators and their number was more than the two third required. There are other concerns about not having ministers and other key appointments by the president. What will be your reaction on this?

Buhari took over on May 29. It is not late yet. We are going there in no distant time. The transition committee has submitted their findings and recommendations which will be carefully followed for implementation and we have started seeing the result. The Accountant General has emerged through a competency test by over 60 qualified candidates and the best was selected. Buhari has always been a very careful and articulate person, so we should give him time. And despite not having ministers, his government is gradually picking up. His first priority regarding insecurity has started seeing drastic reforms and actions. Yes, there should have been such appointments, but he wants to go for competent and trusted people that will do the jobs with zeal and patriotism.

Do you think the APC can survive as a ruling party for as long as the PDP did? I have made this stand several times. I said APC may not be as lucky as the PDP to rule this country for 16 years. It may not be lucky because that myth that incumbents cannot be sacked through electoral processes has been broken by the APC and it has demonstrated that an incumbent who takes the masses for granted can be replaced through a credible election. So, they must be very careful in running the affairs of this country, bearing in mind that Nigerian voters' eyes have been opened wide and they can sack a non-performing government. So they also can be sacked. That was why I was angry with this impunity.

The way Nigerians are prepared to take their destiny in their hands, nobody is coming to cajole them again like what the PDP did in the past 16 years. Nigerians will not be that patient with you. Therefore the change that came, if APC does not take its time, there would be a counter-change. My advise to the leadership of the party as an opposition politician who spent most of his political life in the opposition, I know what the opposition means. I respect the Yoruba political class because of their belief and position in opposition politics. Opposition is not because you hate the government. People misinterpret governance, especially the workings of the opposition. An opposition politician must be patient and must have courage to be in the opposition and remain there, because there is a price you pay.

What will be your reaction to your suspension by the Benue APC leadership over your decision to challenge the emergence of Samuel Ortom as the APC candidate?

If you notice this so called suspension, it has been publicised for some weeks before it was carried out. But I and my other colleagues don't want to comment on it because the matter is with our team of lawyers and it is already in court. How can you suspend a party chieftain that has gone to court to seek redress? In our case, those are the charges they gave us. And if not for the overzealousness of the so called leaders of the party, how can you suspend somebody without asking for his opinion? It shows that the party in Benue State is being controlled by irresponsible people. It has also exposed the party leaders as not having respect for the rule of law.