Dr Ali Ahmad is the chairman, House committee on Justice, in the House of Representatives. The lawmaker, who is also the vice-chairman on oil subsidy probe, represents Ilorin East and South Federal Constituency in the National Assembly. He spoke with journalists in Ilorin recently. Biola Azeez presents the excerpts:

WHAT is your committee doing on the human rights abuses during the last oil subsidy removal protest?
We stand by our resolve to probe the human rights abuses during the January subsidy withdrawal protest. That's why we commended the Lagos commissioner of Police, who, after dismissing the erring officer last week, is now expected to prosecute him. We are working with them. We are in the process of collating the facts of all the actions being taken.We expect the police authorities to do the right thing, especially with the emergence of the new IGP. We are giving him the benefits of the doubt and hope he will go the whole hog on the matter.

What is the situation of affairs with the subsidy probe?
Nigerians have already written their own report. They're just waiting for the official report from the committee because everything was done in the open. There has been pressure from various quarters. We are sure the report will not satisfy the yearnings of everybody. For people who wanted us to go far, we might not go far enough. They will be disappointed. People who do not want us to even move an inch, they will be disappointed.

But whatever we do will be within constitutional bounds. There are people that want us to strangulate, but the constitution does not give that power, because even if we found out someone doing wrong, we are limited by constitutional provision and our terms of reference. So, within those limits, we assure Nigerians that they will not be disappointed.

There are allegations of compromise Nigerians should wait until the submission of the report of the committee. That will be the time to judge whether there's a compromise or not. This committee report may not be the one that will be implemented by the executive and it might be. But we'll ensure it will be implemented by the executive because those are the signals we receive from the ministry and even from Mr President. Even if it's not, the raw report of the committee will be submitted to the Nigerian public. Statements and reports of everyone involved will be attached to the report and given to the public.

What is your view on agitation of Kwara JUSUN and restoration of the state's Chief Judge?
The Supreme Court has ruled and my position is that the ruling stands. The CJ should be allowed to resum her job. But, on the other hand, the workers also have their own complaints. Within the confines of the law, they have the right to go on strike. That's within the law, once they are not violent. If they have complaints, they may be going through the wrong way of expressing their complaints because whatever the Supreme Court says stands.

But I believe what should happen is that if there's an order of the Supreme Court, and implementing it is problematic because of the history of the CJ, then the stakeholders should come in and see how to move the sector forward because people are dying in prison everyday as a result of the fact that the judiciary is not working. The constitutional rights of that person that is not released is being flouted without reason, and there will be a host of other things we might not even know until the end of the matter. The best thing is for the judiciary to start work. If the allegations are true, the allegations are unbefitting of a judicial officer.

What the Supreme Court is saying is that the procedure followed was not good. It must have dawned on her because if you remember, it's even the Nigerian Bar Association (NBA) that kicked against all the things that she did. The state government did not have any problem with the CJ. It was the stakeholders in the sector that raised the alarm, saying, "Look, this is not how the place should be run." So, implementing the judgement is problematic and the National Judicial Council (NJC) now has constitutional duty, as expected, to call all the stakeholders in the sector and see how best to move the sector forward in the state.

The NJC will be the proper authority to call the CJ, NBA, JUSUN and the state government on how best to implement the Supreme Court judgment. If their complaints against her are so horrible that they caanot work with her, it is either you dissolve them or the CJ is elevated to the Court of Appeal or the Supreme Court so that the interest is not made to be about the person but the sector. If it affects the person of the CJ, so be it. Somebody should take action and the NJC should be seen to take the constitutional role. 

Should there be Sovereign National Conference (SNC) or not?
The present situation on Boko Haram is like merging criminality with dialogue. Dialoguing with Boko Haram will not mean that anybody that has been arrested should not be punished. Dialogue is like finding a political solution to the Boko Haram issue because we as a nation have failed in that respect. So, that's trying to make up.The SNC is a digression really because talking about SNC now will not solve any problem. If you say the South and North should stay apart, the North that you are saying should stay apart will even give more impetus to Boko Haram to even kill everybody because they will now overpower the northern government because the federal might is not there again.

Dividing the country or saying everybody should go to his state is defeatist and elitist.The ordinary man in Sabon Garin in Kano doesn't care. He was born in Sabon Garin. For example, I was born and bred in Kaduna. I would have loved to remain in Kaduna, to even contest political position there. I have lots of friends there, but I felt I had to come back home. People calling for the SNC just want to retire to their constituencies where they can overrun everybody. Second, the nation is not working. Nigeria is not working.

Nothing in Nigeria is working. Nobody loves Nigeria and the fact that the ICPC, EFCC is fighting corruption, all the fighting had been at the local and state levels. They hound local government chairmen, they put handcuffs on governors and put them in Abuja, while the biggest thieves are there. The ICPC and EFCC are not working. The biggest corruption in Nigeria is perpetuated in the federal civil service. The day we wake up to this fact, the better for us. More than half of the houses in palatial Abuja are owned by civil servants. Everybody knows it. Check the bank accounts of these people. It runs into billions. So, a local government boss is now investigated for N24 million and you put them in national dailies.

We are just wasting our time. One deputy director or a director in the NNPC controls billions when Kwara State governor does not control more than N3 billion a month. This is a governor that represents 2.5 million people. The useless director goes in tattered suits and controls billions of naira. This country is not working definitely and the answer of a lazy man is to say let's hold an SNC. It doesn't work like that. The SNC is not a panacea for peace. Ask them who should be members. The difficult one is what we should do to honour the founding fathers. That is, let everyone do his best, beginning from the president.That's why I'm happy with the present membership of the National Assembly on the issue. These civil servants tuck in billions upon billions in the budget, expecting you to pass it. So, the easiest questions to proponents of the SNC is to ask them who should be the members. After the membership, what happens?

I'm even happy the North has welcomed the idea.But what about the toil we've gone through in the last 50 years? Nigerians will be the saddest person on earth if the country breaks up. When you have to obtain a visa to go to Lagos, one can develop hypertension if movement is restricted in that way. What is the logical sense in what will be the outcome of the SNC? That's why the National Assembly said if you have problems with the structure that you don't agree with, bring it and the National Assembly is there to debate it. We'll fight but, at the end, the most powerful argument is accepted by all.